Tuesday, July 05, 2005

Regionalism, Arena & Jobs

Click here for a timely story by the Toledo City Paper's Steve Steel on Regionalism and economic development.

Click here for PDF report summary of the Arena feasability study. And click here for the full Pizzuti arena study report.

Finally, click here for a nicely done recap & discussion of the recent East Side meeting on the Marina District.


Blogger Lisa Renee said...

I read the 54 page pdf, and it appears there is a bias towards the downtown site. I can understand the desire to link this arena somehow with Seagate, however as I read the report several questions came to mind. You might not have all of the answers but here goes:

1. This study cost $70,000, it also clearly states on page 28 "As the arena development process moves forward, additional detailed market research should be completed to refine these estimates." So given that how much would the next study cost, how long will it take and how reliable are these numbers given this?

2. It appears many of the items they are assuming will or could be held at the new arena are already being held at other locations in town, mainly the Seagate Convention Center. Replacing one venue with another doesn't appear to be adding an overall profit to the city.

3. Why and how do they assume that club seats would have to be $5.00 cheaper if on the other side of the river as well as naming rights being listed as lower on the east side if they have not done a complete detailed market analysis of our area?

4. The report also states a detailed traffic study should be done as a part of making a final decision for which location. Having been to both Sports Arena and Fifth Third events traffic congestion after events is pretty much a given no matter where the location is isn't it? How much is this additional detailed traffic study going to cost and when would it be started?

On the issue of parking alone if that were the only deciding factor yes it does appear the downtown location would not require a large amount of additional parking.

Those are the first questions that came to me as I read the full document.

4:55 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Let's keep this simple with some simple logic.

Downtown is the best location. Arena in downtown would bring new foot traffic and keep the senergy flowing, the road access to the freeways is better on the downtown side than east side. Use the east side for residential, boat docks, and open space to enjoy the view of downtown and continue the greenspace of the Interational Park. Hotels and restaurants needs to be accessible to the arena which they are on the downtown side. Existing parking lots and garages is available in downtown not east side. Connecting arena to the convention center, workplaces, hotels, and 5/3 Field is the key to economics and access not just for Toledoans but for regional level perhaps national. Let's utilize the current infrastructures instead of creating new ones. So clear choice with clear logic--DOWNTOWN!

6:37 AM  
Anonymous Sepp said...

I am also curious as to how the E. side will handle traffic and parking. East Toledo isn't the most traffic friendy place as it is. I can see the city leaders deciding that homes near the area are "blighted" and in need of being bulldozed in the name of "progress". Progress being a parking lot.

9:21 AM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

That's a good article. The difference is that Ford has had four years already to work on it but nothing has happened. Carty will get it done.

9:55 AM  
Anonymous Sepp said...

Carty's "Carty gets it done" slogan is a no holds barred slap in the face to Ford who has done little or nothing of real substance. Carty will capitalize on that and could see success with it. Driving down Harvard blvd in south Toledo, I saw a Carty sign in nearly every yard. Even the ones that had Ford signs in them 5 years ago.

12:23 PM  
Blogger Frank said...

"Carty will get it done." - we're talking regional cooperation here. Carty set regionalism back as Mayor, Jack Ford has got it moving - look at the reconstituted LCIC, look at the JEDZ developments. Look at the universities working together. Look at the RGP transitioning to private financing to sharpen its regional focus. City-county cooperation. All this on Jack's watch, not Carty's.

12:38 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The RGP going private was a direct slap in the face of Ford and current city of Toledo office holders. The private sector finally had enough of career politicians who had never had a job in the private sector trying to be involved with economic development. The RGP was reached its breaking point with the union and Blade hacks running city hall. They decided to go it alone. It's sad -- but true.

4:39 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

The LCIC is a joke. Toledo is so desparate for "regionalism" to get its hands on the outlying areas money, all of which is running as fast as it can out of the city. If "regionalism" was such a great idea, wouldn't the suburbs embrace it instead of suing to try to stop it.

4:48 PM  
Blogger Frank said...

Suburbs didnt sue, one township did. LCIC isnt a joke, it has the support of the RGP and Port Authority, and the County Commissioners. Both the public and private sectors have important roles in economic development.

The private sector should stand up and contribute to the RGP - I congratulate them for it. As a consultant for the Port Levy campaign last year, I heard firsthand what some in the private sector tired of, and that was trying to pass the Port Levy.

6:47 PM  
Blogger Lisa Renee said...

From how I understood it, being that one township is my township, there were others that had issue with the original problems that led to the lawsuit as well. Granted they were the only one who filed but they did have support and a large number of the different township trustees had discussed this.

LCIC has the potential to get alot done if they can manage to work together, they did not start off on a very good beginning but it appears last I heard everyone is trying to move past that and concentrate on getting things done.

9:01 PM  
Blogger Frank said...

Thanks for reading the report Lisa Renee...

The 70k report was pasrt of our Phase One agreement with Pizzuti. I expect the Mayor in the next few weeks to advance to City Council an ordinance on Phase Two. I expect Pizzuti will go into the kind of market research that measures investor interest based upon various locations. This is an important step, as it goes to question of financing a public-private partnership.

Your "replacing" the venue question is a good one, and you need to factor not only the Convention Center but also a new and improved Savage Hall on campus. This is a real question.

Naming rights & club seats could very well be lower at an East Side location, which I seem to remember happening with the Mud Hens ballpak project.

Also during the ballpark project, we did a traffic and parking study: more than enough surface parking downtown. I'll dig out that report, it compared parking downtown to parking at Franklin Park & Southwyck (where people walk farther to get to things than they do around 5/3 Field.)

thanks for your interest in this stuff...

11:42 PM  
Blogger Lisa Renee said...

I understand the parking portion of it, that clearly is a pro-downtown issue.

I cross posted my questions at toledo talk with an additional statement if you get a chance to head over there. I don't normally do that as you know but felt it was an important issue to discuss.

Thank you for your concern as well in the venue shifting category. I did see one possible positive that I wrote on TT that if events are taken from Seagate especially some of the local usage that was listed for the new arena currently done at Seagate it might free up Seagate to do more out of town type conventions. This would be possible no matter the arena location. Thougth the tandem use of both a new arena and Seagate would only be feasible if it was close to Seagate. I did wonder how often that would be an issue, but it is a valid issue.

I think part of this is how long we have talked about a new arena. I was disappointed that this study was not more detail oriented to Toledo as it is obvious more studies are going to need to be done which will further delay this.

Either way, hopefully this time it will move forward and be done in a way that diminishes problems for those in the east side that feel that Toledo voters approved an arena in an east side location.

I hate to see division when it comes to things that will be the benefit of the whole area.

Thanks for posting this, I'm getting into this a bit late but better late than never. I also share the hopes of those who believe the arena should not be a campaign issue. It's obvious from reading that report we are years away from this being a reality and that being the case should not be a political football to play with. Unless of course one of them becomes anti-arena all together, then that should be addressed but I don't think that will happen.

12:48 AM  
Blogger Lester Pearson said...

Sixty million dollars (U.S.) for a parking garage?

What's the annual capital works budget for your fair city?

Sixty million dollars for a parking garage? Surely that is a typographical error.

9:08 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

That's why the downtown is the most feasible location yet attractive! Remember the word "logic"?

9:44 PM  
Anonymous Marshall said...

The city as a whole will be much better served if the arena is located downtown. Look at other cities and see where successful arenas are located (Lexington, Nashville, Memphis, Indianapolis, Cincinatti, Cleveland, Saint Louis, etc.). Build it next to 5/3 field and connect it to the Seagate Center. More conventions and larger conventions will be drawn to it because access to both facilities can be used, which could very well attract a major hotel to build (Marriott, Hilton, Sheraton, etc.). More restaurants, bars, entertainment, and maybe even shopping will be spurred because of regular crowds from hockey, the new basketball team, concerts, and hopefully an arena football team. None of this will happen if the arena locates on teh East Side, and it could even harm the Marina District with its use of prime real estate. Frank, please do the smart thing and push for a downtown site.

5:09 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Where is the marina in the marina district? An arena can be built anywhere but a marina needs water.

8:22 PM  

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